Post by: Lee Nicholas on August 08, 2021, 10:38:35 PM
A.) Dedicated engine operating screen. Number one complaint from my crew
B.) Consisting/linking. Way to difficult to add or subtract engines to a consist i.e. to add helpers in route all engines are unlinked then all have to be linked. Pain in the butt.
C.) Ability to control headlights on linked locos
D.) Override button to bypass warning messages. Needed if you use Keep Alives or PBM’s
E.) Load function. Use knob to set speed and the brake to ramp up or down.
Feel free to add to the list but keep it focused on the HC’s. All suggestions will be passed on to Tim.
Thanks for your support.
Lee Nicholas
Corinne, Utah
Post by: ron045 on August 08, 2021, 11:28:57 PM
While I can instantly kill the throttle, I like to run with a load so it takes the train a while to stop. An E Stop that would really function as an All Stop for all RP trains (either track powered or battery powered) would really be helpful.
Thanks. Good thread.
Ron
Post by: G8B4Life on August 09, 2021, 06:51:37 AM
- A "dark" UI, like I was throwing around a long time ago.
- A less cluttered Locomotive control screen. Some things you don't do while driving, like setting the module up, creating/ breaking down MU's so things like that could be accessed from a separate page from a single Fn button.
- Use while charging.
- For the HC-3 (too late for the -2), easy access to change the batteries, this is a consumer device, not an onsite managed commercial product with a support plan!
- Tim
Post by: Alan on August 09, 2021, 07:32:18 AM
Post by: atsfguy on August 09, 2021, 07:48:00 AM
Post by: Josephbw on August 09, 2021, 08:53:43 AM
Add a more ergonomically shaped HC, possibly a hammer-head to the list.
This would be number 1 on my list.
Joe
Post by: KPack on August 09, 2021, 10:20:39 AM
A.) Dedicated engine operating screen. Number one complaint from my crew
B.) Consisting/linking. Way to difficult to add or subtract engines to a consist i.e. to add helpers in route all engines are unlinked then all have to be linked. Pain in the butt.
C.) Ability to control headlights on linked locos
D.) Override button to bypass warning messages. Needed if you use Keep Alives or PBM’s
E.) Load function. Use knob to set speed and the brake to ramp up or down.
Lee, could you provide a little clarification on these?
A.) What do you mean by a dedicated engine operating screen? Are you saying to remove some of the items from the current locomotive operating screen?
B.) I agree with this one....I'd like to add an option to "flip" the consist with a tap of a button so that the previous last locomotive now becomes the leader (useful while switching with a consist). It would be faster than breaking the consist and redoing it.
C.) I'm confused on this one.....you already have full control of all functions on linked locomotives....just select that locomotive and turn on the lights as necessary. Are you saying you want the following locomotive headlight to turn on when the consist is reversed?
D.) I completely ignore all warning messages. When they pop up it doesn't prevent me from operating the locomotive, and most of the time I'm not even looking at the screen. The only time I ever look at a warning message is if the locomotive will not respond to any commands. It's a very rare occurrence and it usually means something went catastrophically wrong.
E.) Not sure I understand this one. Use the brake to set the load?? Sounds like you're asking for a combo of manual notching and load.
In addition to the notes I made above, I would really like to see a factory-installed eyelet for a lanyard. Ergonomics of the controller doesn't bother me that much, especially if there is a lanyard. Less functional improvements like a dark UI would be nice, but not critical to me at this point.
-Kevin
Post by: ON28 on August 09, 2021, 02:37:53 PM
1. Simpler method for sizing and uploading loco images
2. Lanyard hook
3. Lighter weight, slimmer HC
4. Time/clock on loco screen
5. Emergency stop on loco screen
6. Non-marring HC holder for layout fascia
There's a discussion to be had about the industry-wide move to wifi throttles and what it means for RP.
Post by: Lee Nicholas on August 09, 2021, 05:25:16 PM
Lee, could you provide a little clarification on these?
A.) What do you mean by a dedicated engine operating screen? Are you saying to remove some of the items from the current locomotive operating screen?
*** All that don't apply to running a train. Locate all the engine setup requirements on a separate setup screen. No need for the crew to worry about setup requirements.
B.) I agree with this one....I'd like to add an option to "flip" the consist with a tap of a button so that the previous last locomotive now becomes the leader (useful while switching with a consist). It would be faster than breaking the consist and redoing it.
*** Agree
C.) I'm confused on this one.....you already have full control of all functions on linked locomotives....just select that locomotive and turn on the lights as necessary. Are you saying you want the following locomotive headlight to turn on when the consist is reversed?
*** Yes
D.) I completely ignore all warning messages. When they pop up it doesn't prevent me from operating the locomotive, and most of the time I'm not even looking at the screen. The only time I ever look at a warning message is if the locomotive will not respond to any commands. It's a very rare occurrence and it usually means something went catastrophically wrong.
*** If you have PBM's installed and receive a motor overload warning you cannot ignore the message. The only way to get rid of it is to remove the engine from the tracks until it resets. This can take 20 seconds and is a pain. Tim is aware and promised and over ride button to make it go away.
E.) Not sure I understand this one. Use the brake to set the load?? Sounds like you're asking for a combo of manual notching and load.
*** Set the load with the knob as currently we currently do. Once engines are moving use the brake button to reduce speed rather than having to turn the knob to zero before the brake will engage. When brake is released have it ramp up to the knob setting. Would make it very nice for switching. I like the load feature for switching but it's very cumbersome they way it's setup.
In addition to the notes I made above, I would really like to see a factory-installed eyelet for a lanyard. Ergonomics of the controller doesn't bother me that much, especially if there is a lanyard. Less functional improvements like a dark UI would be nice, but not critical to me at this point.
*** Tim has eyelets I sent him a bunch. If you ask he will install anyway that the last I heard.
Lee
Post by: KPack on August 09, 2021, 06:14:14 PM
If you are getting motor overload warnings, I'm assuming you are having that happen on older locomotives? I've had it before, but it was on my older blue box locos. An override option would be a nice thing.
-Kevin
Post by: William Brillinger on August 10, 2021, 07:16:51 AM
- Yes Please, Take all the things that are not needed for operation off of this screen and maybe give us another row of buttons.
- Ditch the loco picture and only show the Loco name/number and have as many programmable buttons as possible on the screen. 4 rows? This could be an optional mode set in the HC options, call it "operations mode" vs "default mode"
B.) Consisting/linking. Way to difficult to add or subtract engines to a consist i.e. to add helpers in route all engines are unlinked then all have to be linked. Pain in the butt.
- Yes Please, Adding or removing a loco should be easy without rebuilding a consist, and a swap ends option would be nice.
C.) Ability to control headlights on linked locos
- When the rear light button on the screen is selected, it should turn on the rear most light in the consist.
D.) Override button to bypass warning messages. Needed if you use Keep Alives or PBM’s
- Yes Please!
E.) Load function. Use knob to set speed and the brake to ramp up or down.
- I would like the load function to stay as is, but have the ability to also notch up and down with the manual buttons at the same time. No need for this to be an either/or situation with separate setup.
- How it would work? I see the automatic notching being overridden by the notch up and down buttons until the speed dial is set to zero, then it should spool the sound down and go back to automatic.
I would also like to see a notch indicator on the screen showing what notch the engine is in, in both manual and automatic mode.
Post by: potlatcher on August 10, 2021, 04:13:32 PM
- Warning message override button
- Improved consist linking/unlinking
- E-stop button
- Lanyard loop
Post by: KPack on August 10, 2021, 04:38:13 PM
Based on everything I've read here and my own thoughts, I would say the following are things I'd like to see:
1.) Improved consist linking/unlinking/switching leader/adding to consist
2.) Lanyard loop standard on all throttles
3.) Warning message override
4.) Hybrid manual/automatic notching (similar to Bill's description)
5.) Locomotive screen update....uncluttered ops mode with more function buttons would be great. Currently I run out of functions....16 isn't enough.
-Kevin
Post by: TJMac on August 10, 2021, 04:46:46 PM
Post by: Josephbw on August 10, 2021, 05:08:18 PM
Thanks for this, Lee!
1. Simpler method for sizing and uploading loco images
2. Lanyard hook
3. Lighter weight, slimmer HC
4. Time/clock on loco screen
5. Emergency stop on loco screen
6. Non-marring HC holder for layout fascia
Bill sells a nice wooden box lined with a slick-faced foam that is made to fit the HC. It works great and I would highly recommend it. It comes disassembled and is very easy to put together.
Joe
There's a discussion to be had about the industry-wide move to wifi throttles and what it means for RP.
Post by: IRW on August 10, 2021, 05:28:47 PM
Post by: darryl.trains on August 10, 2021, 05:41:13 PM
Post by: WyldBill on August 10, 2021, 06:51:07 PM
Improved consisting
Dedicated loco operating screen
lanyard hook.
These improvements would be extremely helpful.....a dedicated E stop button would be nice as well.
Thanks,
WyldBill
Post by: William Brillinger on August 10, 2021, 07:12:43 PM
The system is okay, but not moving forward in my observation. The sounds of the locomotives change at 29/30 and about 45% of throttle. Would be nice to have a "Drive Hold" feature like ESU. Seems to me it could be made to be more realistic. I defer to the experts like Lee for changes - but if I had to replace my current assets I most likely switch to DCC to get the advantage of newer features.
Try manual notching instead of the load feature. You get a notch up and notch down button that allow you to change the sound of the engine without affecting the speed, BUT unlike "drive hold," you can still use the knob to adjust the speed. (ie: got a heavy load? start rolling, notch up all the way, then slowly adjust the throttle to achieve the speed action you want. Then back off the notches once you are up to full speed to imitate coasting.)
Post by: tedcurtin on August 10, 2021, 08:00:59 PM
Post by: JD of Georgia on August 10, 2021, 08:04:47 PM
I can’t see the engine pictures anyway… may I’ll make a “picture” of the unit type and number and use that! Hmmmm…..
Post by: Dean on August 10, 2021, 09:06:47 PM
The e-stop button would be an excellent addition. So are removable batteries.
The one thing I would like to see is a knurled knob.
It would be nice to have a small dumbed-down hand controller for guests.
Post by: G8B4Life on August 10, 2021, 09:39:01 PM
Yes I think there's too much clutter on the Locomotive control screen. I find this is mostly from having two buttons available on each end of the loco picture and the load bar graph. This is the last mockup I did and took a few hints from real loco control screens. With this one the MU'ing, module setup etc are accessed from the setup button, which gives you the choices of setup MU, break MU, setup module etc.
I was trying to figure out a way to get rid of the bar graph to unclutter that area but gave up.
As long as an "operations mode" screen was an option, not the norm I guess it wouldn't be an issue but I think the picture (of some sort) needs to be kept, it helps defines which end is the front (pretty easy with modern day stuff, not so easy with older diesels) and is used to quickly gain access to the loco select screen.
I would like to see more function "slots" available, 16 isn't enough these days.
Quote
C.) Ability to control headlights on linked locos
- When the rear light button on the screen is selected, it should turn on the rear most light in the consist.
Is that the way it works in the real world in the US and Canada? It doesn't here. I'd hate to introduce something unprototypical, it's bad enough he had to put in the toy train auto switch headlights on direction change.
Swapping ends of a consist, hmm I remember mentioning that here years ago and getting a no need response. Good to see the idea gaining traction.
- Tim
Post by: SCL1923 on August 10, 2021, 10:10:33 PM
Thanks for the thread
SCL
Post by: A and D Railroad on August 10, 2021, 10:30:01 PM
I will need repeaters to operate the trains over the entire layout.
I also think a less expensive way to operate turnouts should be available.
The g scale receiver does not have enough outputs to run the sound, lights whistle, bell, video camera and remote coupler.
A longer range. Receiver or transmitter wiuld b useful.
Post by: FScaleSteam on August 10, 2021, 10:44:08 PM
Post by: KPack on August 11, 2021, 12:10:53 AM
Please add chuff syncro input. Doesn't seem there are many tea kettle modelers here but having the chuff all set up nice just it have it sound like dogs barfing at higher or lower speeds is not fun. Thanks
The LM-3S-G now has chuff sync input. It will hopefully soon be added to the LM-3S.
-Kevin
Post by: Cbrocco on August 11, 2021, 08:57:30 AM
I like the locomotive pictures and think it makes the controller easier for guests to understand. I vote to leave the loco pictures in.
1. Without a doubt, more buttons function pages. 2 pages isn't enough.
2. Faster upload times for files to the LMs. It takes me about 3 hours to load a new LM from HC and that's using the virtual HC too.
If you need a lanyard holder for your HC until HC's come with it, there is one here:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/233847750842?hash=item36726980ba:g:FVkAAOSwSadf9Hvk
-Chris
Post by: cdp48 on August 11, 2021, 09:01:33 AM
Craig Phillips
Spokane International
Salem, Oregon
Post by: michealtaylor220 on August 11, 2021, 09:56:42 AM
Post by: nodcc4me on August 11, 2021, 10:25:06 AM
Post by: Cbrocco on August 11, 2021, 11:44:03 AM
Please add chuff syncro input. Doesn't seem there are many tea kettle modelers here but having the chuff all set up nice just it have it sound like dogs barfing at higher or lower speeds is not fun. Thanks
The LM-3S-G now has chuff sync input. It will hopefully soon be added to the LM-3S.
-Kevin
How do you setup the chuff input?
Post by: Josephunh on August 11, 2021, 02:43:31 PM
- Lanyard connection
- Changing batteries. Either allowing owners to replace or changing to lithium
- E-Stop
Post by: cws on August 11, 2021, 03:05:06 PM
Great work guys, all these suggestions are excellent. I'm looking forward to seeing all of them implemented at some point...
1) dedicated engine operating screen
2) improving the consisting/linking functions
3) override but to bypass warning messages
4) load function control
5) E-stop
6) replaceable battery!
7) quicker upload/programming of the controller....
And thanks to Bill for the email blast that got my attention!
thanks,
Carl
Post by: KPack on August 11, 2021, 04:03:20 PM
-Kevin
Post by: fianet on August 11, 2021, 04:38:04 PM
1. Eyelet for a lanyard
2. flip the consist with a tap of a button
3. Dedicated E-stop button Via Software and hardware
4. Uncluttered ops mode (no setup stuff)
5. Change to lithium replaceable battery(s).
Lee, I might be a good Idea for you to review all the posts and provide ring with a list of most wanted in order of the posters popularity since as one poster noted, Tim might explode seeing ALL of these "wishes' that in many cases are long overdue.
At one point, ring had an advanced product but like all things, you must change to go forward and not backward.
GG Huber
Post by: Randy on August 11, 2021, 06:08:00 PM
Please add chuff syncro input. Doesn't seem there are many tea kettle modelers here but having the chuff all set up nice just it have it sound like dogs barfing at higher or lower speeds is not fun. Thanks
The LM-3S-G now has chuff sync input. It will hopefully soon be added to the LM-3S.
-Kevin
How do you setup the chuff input?
I own 2 RailPro throttles and 3 LM-3s. Since then, I have purchased 6 Phoenix P-8 soundcards and Airwire receivers and 4 Airwire throttles SIMPLY because of the lack of a syncronized chuff in the RailPro's.
Syncronized chuffs can be just as important to "Tea-kettlers" as having the correct diesel sound for their EMD or ALCO such-and-such!
Shame it you are taking so long to finish the LM-3's chuff wire set-up, as I really like the Rail Pro and would have saved a lot of installation time and some money too.
Been enjoying my Airwire/Phoenix equipped steam locos for a couple of years now. Sorry, can't wait for you while my life is ticking away.
That said, how about an RGS Galloping Goose sound???
OR:
How about releasing your secret engine rev-up/down sound building method so everyone can add to the selection of gas engine/diesel sounds, thereby improving the enjoyment of the entire hobby, and I will record and make my own Goose sounds.
In my many years, I have seen several proprietary systems get left by the wayside for taking too long to give the customers what they want.
Post by: KPack on August 11, 2021, 06:14:45 PM
Please add chuff syncro input. Doesn't seem there are many tea kettle modelers here but having the chuff all set up nice just it have it sound like dogs barfing at higher or lower speeds is not fun. Thanks
The LM-3S-G now has chuff sync input. It will hopefully soon be added to the LM-3S.
-Kevin
That's a question for Ring Engineering. I don't have a LM-3S-G, and the ability to do chuff sync was just added in the most recent update. The LM-3S-G manual is not updated yet with the info on it. LM-3S will follow soon.
-Kevin
How do you setup the chuff input?
Post by: Lee Nicholas on August 11, 2021, 07:47:03 PM
We need to approach Tim with a reasonable request for upgrades, so he doesn’t jump of the cliff. I talk with him frequently and know he’s plenty busy and pretty much works to a priority list and hopefully our list below will get added.
I have read through all the input several times and submit the following as what I will present to Tim and hope you all concur.
1) Dedicated engine operating screen. Number one complaint.
Take all the things that are not needed for operation off this screen and maybe give us another row of buttons. Ditch the loco picture and only show the Loco name/number and have as many programmable buttons as possible on the screen. 4 rows? This could be an optional mode set in the HC options, call it "operations mode" vs "default mode"
2) Improving the consisting/linking functions. Way to difficult to add or subtract engines to a consist i.e., to add helpers in route all engines are unlinked then all have to be linked. Ability to control headlights on linked locos. Adding or removing a loco should be easy without rebuilding a consist. and a swap ends option would be nice.
3) Override button to bypass warning messages.
4) Load function. Use knob to set speed and the brake to ramp up or down.
Display a notch indicator on the screen showing what notch the engine is in, in both manual and automatic mode.
Lee
Post by: William Brillinger on August 11, 2021, 08:41:34 PM
Post by: G8B4Life on August 11, 2021, 10:48:37 PM
Designing your own screen and theme wouldn't actually be that hard for TR to do.
- Tim
Post by: Lee Nicholas on August 12, 2021, 07:08:49 AM
Any "operations" mode screen that does not have a way to identify the forward direction of the loco * must * be optional, not a replacement.
Not sure I understand your comment
Lee
Post by: G8B4Life on August 12, 2021, 09:08:59 AM
A better way perhaps than just a pure option in the settings is that you can switch to the operations screen when you want to from the current control screen, and back again too.
- Tim
Post by: chilliard on August 12, 2021, 09:49:11 AM
Cody
Post by: KPack on August 12, 2021, 09:51:50 AM
-Kevin
Post by: William Brillinger on August 12, 2021, 11:01:50 AM
Quote
so how do you tell which way is forwards and which way is backwards for the loco?
I don't use locomotive images at all (I just use the railway logo, CN BNSF etc for the image) and I have never even thought to care which way is forward or backwards based on the image. For diesels at least, there is a little F on the actual locomotive to denote the front in North America.
Post by: Cbrocco on August 12, 2021, 11:27:46 AM
I also like the image there.
Post by: William Brillinger on August 12, 2021, 11:54:57 AM
I guess I'm missing something. The loco image is a functional button. It brings you to your locomotive list. Why do we want to remove this? Resize it maybe but this is the easiest way to select your loco without going to the home screen.
I also like the image there.
We don't want to completely remove it, we want the option to have the space reallocated for more functionality.
There is no reason that the loco name/number which would continue to be on the display could not become the loco list button.
Also if we get the running setup options, all moved off to another screen so they cannot accidentally be tapped, the loco list button would logically also move to the new running setup screen.
The big problem is when visiting operators who are not familiar with the HC interface accidentally tap these setup buttons, like the loco list or unlink buttons, they end up in places they have no idea how to get out of or how they got there, and potentially with their consist broken or worse yet as a runaway because they don't know how to navigate back quickly enough to avoid an accident.
We are proposing that there be a basic mode that is basically the way it is now but with a way to lockout accidental presses of setup options, and an advanced mode where we can have more functions on the screen. Most larger layout operators do not desire or need the loco image. They would prefer more function buttons in that space.
Post by: Cbrocco on August 12, 2021, 12:12:31 PM
I guess I'm missing something. The loco image is a functional button. It brings you to your locomotive list. Why do we want to remove this? Resize it maybe but this is the easiest way to select your loco without going to the home screen.
I also like the image there.
We don't want to completely remove it, we want the option to have the space reallocated for more functionality.
There is no reason that the loco name/number which would continue to be on the display could not become the loco list button.
Also if we get the running setup options, all moved off to another screen so they cannot accidentally be tapped, the loco list button would logically also move to the new running setup screen.
The big problem is when visiting operators who are not familiar with the HC interface accidentally tap these setup buttons, like the loco list or unlink buttons, they end up in places they have no idea how to get out of or how they got there, and potentially with their consist broken or worse yet as a runaway because they don't know how to navigate back quickly enough to avoid an accident.
We are proposing that there be a basic mode that is basically the way it is now but with a way to lockout accidental presses of setup options, and an advanced mode where we can have more functions on the screen. Most larger layout operators do not desire or need the loco image. They would prefer more function buttons in that space.
Okay I get it now, I agree with this :) Thanks for the clarification.
Post by: Michael Boyer on August 12, 2021, 09:35:58 PM
Post by: G8B4Life on August 12, 2021, 10:45:52 PM
For diesels at least, there is a little F on the actual locomotive to denote the front in North America.
No little F down here ;), and double enders both ends are technically forward and reverse depending on which cab your driving from, but we won't get into that!
I was thinking about this as I lay going to sleep last night and it got me wondering, the two prevalent issues are too much clutter and wanting an operations screen with more buttons on it, 4 rows having been suggested. To me that cancels each other out. I'm all for removing things that you shouldn't do while driving from being easily accessed from the control screen (like MU'ing for example) but, and this is just my opinion, having every function available on the one screen is probably counter productive.
That said, I suggest that we come up with mockups of what we want so we can all decide and give TR what we want.
- Tim
Post by: faithie999 on August 13, 2021, 06:19:07 AM
Ken
Post by: William Brillinger on August 13, 2021, 07:45:37 AM
Quote
too much clutter and wanting an operations screen with more buttons on it, 4 rows having been suggested. To me that cancels each other out. I'm all for removing things that you shouldn't do while driving from being easily accessed from the control screen (like MU'ing for example) but, and this is just my opinion, having every function available on the one screen is probably counter productive.
As with the existing rows of customizable buttons, any position unused would be blank, so you can have it as cluttered or uncluttered as you want.
Some people have a lot of small sound effects that they want easy access to while operating.
For me (and someone like Kevin) these would be on the first page, anything that is configured once would be on the second page. Ie the prime mover start button is on the second page along with the step lights and main light on/off's. Horn, Bell, The Notch up, Notch down, Front Dim, Rear Dim, Ditch Dim, dynamic brake, a few coupler clunks, fans button sound, brake sound, flange squeal, etc would be on the first page.
IDEA::: I Guess the setup buttons could be moved to only be on PAGE TWO, with a lock/unlock toggle button to enable them so there really is no possibility of an accidental press and they would always be out of the way.
Post by: William Brillinger on August 13, 2021, 08:58:10 AM
It keeps the image, but adds a lot of flexibility and include the config button on only one of the 2 screens.
With this setup, on a layout like Lee's I would put all the single use items on PAGE one, and all the regular operations buttons on page 2, so when you access the loco for the first time, you configure it on page one, lock the buttons, switch to page 2 and had it to the operator. Then the operator can switch between page one and two but not get lost.
Page 1 has the config so it makes sense to have it as the first screen you are presented with, and is also functional as the default "basic" control screen.
Page 2 is less cluttered so it makes sense to have this as the "main screen" when running for a more advanced setup.
Post by: G8B4Life on August 13, 2021, 12:42:42 PM
I'll have to make a proper reply after sleep (it's half past three in the morning) but one thing that is missing Bill is the fault indicator, that is probably a too important thing to leave out. Not sure about locking the exit button, I'll have to think about that one.
Also folks remember every new screen, function etc that we want takes up room on the HC. Probably not a major issue for the -2b but if we also want to carry these upgrades over to the older -2 (which we should) then it's something to keep in mind.
Bill, I may send you an email... later.
- Tim
Post by: Lee Nicholas on August 13, 2021, 01:44:52 PM
I would suggest adding two Fwd/Rev buttons and locate them at the bottom of each corner. It would then be easy to reach them with the thumb and would work for RH or LH users.
Better yet let the user define the placement to suit their needs.
I sent Tim an email yesterday he has responded and I will post his comments later.
Lee
Post by: William Brillinger on August 13, 2021, 02:03:27 PM
Tim: Locking out the exit button is crucial to what Lee is experiencing - Visiting USERS leaving the control screen and not being able to get back on their own. The info button could be combined with the Fault indicator. There is also the red fault indicator in the uppermost line on the screen.
Post by: tupsters on August 14, 2021, 04:06:38 AM
Post by: KB02 on August 14, 2021, 06:41:48 AM
- Please keep the picture - That's one of the features that drew me to Railpro.
- I had no idea, until reading this post, that picture was actually an active button on the loco screen! Cool!
- Editing the consist would be awesome.
- The dark screen mode would be fantastic.
I am not hugely into operations and don't belong to any club and the only DCC system I have used is the basic MRC controller. To say Railpro is an improvement is an understatement. To see these improvements, though, would be great.
Post by: Tom on August 14, 2021, 10:26:26 AM
I do wonder though how much resource Ring has to do all the software updating for HCs, LMs, and maybe PWRs and ARs too while making sure all updated and non-updated components all work with HC changes regardless of where they are in the updating process. This string is only with regard to HCs, but there are lots of complaints about his server and download problems he also probably needs to address.
I have very little knowledge of DCC stuff, but would like to hear what someone who does has to say about suggestions for HC improvements, and others if critical, that will keep RailPro ahead of the competition, if indeed that is where RailPro now is. I am aware that the DCC crowd may not think this is the case.
Post by: G8B4Life on August 14, 2021, 11:08:11 AM
I thought that the ease of setting up a consist was supposed to be major advantage for RailPro compared to DCC!
It was and still is, the problem is dealing with it when you want to change it. There is no way to just subtract one unit, or swap ends (the load sharing works best when the lead unit is actually in the lead) without breaking the whole consist apart and rebuilding it. Note, that DCC isn't any better in that regard as far as I know.
I also wonder at times how much time TR has (does he do something else besides RE?). Things seem to move at a glacial pace. I've covered his server before so I won't go into it again here.
RailPro is not ahead of the competition anymore as far as I'm concerned, overall on par I'd say. For the most part we still have the lead in technology, the other side has the lead in the user experience. We can fix the ux, but I think it will be an uphill battle. I am eagerly awaiting Lee to come back and post the comments from TR.
Bill, I understand the reason, what I'm saying is the risk outweighed by the convenience? Ok, so you've locked the screen so visitors can't get out of the control screen easily so now you can't exit out to estop the train, or does the lock not affect the on/off/main page button?
Also, unless I'm misunderstanding you the indicator on the top line only indicates if RF communication is present or not, it does not indicate any of the other faults.
- Tim
Post by: William Brillinger on August 14, 2021, 11:41:26 AM
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Ok, so you've locked the screen so visitors can't get out of the control screen easily so now you can't exit out to estop the train, or does the lock not affect the on/off/main page button?
Nothing should block access to the estop button or the power button on the HC.
Again, Status could be combined with the round info button.
Post by: Gibs on August 14, 2021, 04:23:23 PM
No removal of loco image, rather two seperate modes of operations for the HC.
The way I see it working the best is in a new model of the HC. HC-3, on this version you would install a small slide switch in the all new battery access area to select either Setup Mode or Operations Mode.
Now you get a dedicated screen layout for Ops that is user customisable. There can also be either a physical big red E-Button or a Virtual one depending on the community preferred option.
End of two and five cents worth. 😊
Post by: ron045 on August 15, 2021, 07:03:51 AM
What might be handy is some kind of button setup replicator. After you get diesel #1 setup with all the sounds, lights and buttons you want. Then duplicate that setup for Diesel engine #2 so you do not have to reprogram all the buttons from scratch.
I don't understand all the comments about lanyards. Mine came with one. Did I just get lucky?
Ron
Post by: Mike3326 on August 24, 2021, 11:53:57 PM
Post by: William Brillinger on August 25, 2021, 06:13:53 AM
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I run into problems with range on a 70’ layout (length).
The PWR-56 can be configured as a repeater, but you have to enable it.
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My batteries die pretty fast in my HC-2, so being able to switch them out would be beneficial or operate then HC-2 while plugged in.
The indicator goes to Red? or the indicator shows the battery is low?
Most people get 8 or more hours of actual run time from the HC regardless of what the indicator says.
If the indicator is not showing RED then you probably have a lot more run time than you think and the battery meter is out of sync.
If your HC is older and actually needs replacement batteries, contact Ring and they will change them for you. When I did this, there was no charge for the service.
Ring can also install a lanyard kit for you at the same time.
Post by: William Brillinger on August 25, 2021, 06:17:12 AM
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While more customizable buttons are a plus, I don't want a bed of completely blank buttons for every new install. I like having a standard set up to run outta the box. Then allow me to add/delete/move.
Unused buttons on the HC do not show. You wouldn't see any blank buttons.
The standard button setup out of the box would not change.
Add or delete as you desire is what I am proposing, but on a more flexible button layout.
Post by: G8B4Life on August 25, 2021, 08:38:52 AM
If your HC is older and actually needs replacement batteries, contact Ring and they will change them for you. When I did this, there was no charge for the service.
But who paid the freight there and back Bill? I would be very surprised if Ring covered that.
- Tim
Post by: William Brillinger on August 25, 2021, 11:25:48 AM
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But who paid the freight there and back Bill? I would be very surprised if Ring covered that.
I'm not saying you shouldn't replace the batteries, or that the process shouldn't be easier but at least Ring took care of it.
I paid shipping one way.
Post by: faithie999 on August 25, 2021, 06:06:24 PM
Post by: ON28 on August 29, 2021, 05:56:19 PM
Post by: gcarter1945 on September 04, 2021, 05:08:38 PM
I would like to see a slider switch on the body of the HC that would select the operations mode or the set-up mode, and, possibly the accessories mode (although I don't have any accessories and/or turnouts to control); thus alleviating the bummer of accidentally switching to a screen that you don't want at the most inopportune time. You could still have the option of setting up the buttons on the screen you choose whether that be 4, 8, 12, or 16 buttons per screen even if more that 8 were spread among two or more pages. The placing of the slider should be in an ergonomic sensible location.
For what its worth, I like the loco picture on the main screen. It would be a boon if there was a graphics conversion element to the RailPro Assistant program so one could modify a photo and see what it would look like on the HC before going to the trouble of having to load it onto the HC/LM first.
Geoff
Too soon old, too late smart.
Post by: Gibs on September 04, 2021, 07:19:25 PM
That's how I see it being done as well, as I made mention before up above, a Main HC that does it all, the HC-3. But I also had a thought later on, what if there was also a new HC just for Operator's, the HC-3O (Operator ONLY) like you sorta get with the small Digitrax controller. All this smaller version can do is Operate any loco that the operator needs too from the Loco list. Heck it can even be of the " Hammer" design with a slightly smaller screen in the Head of the Hammer. It could also have a lanyard point and be USB chargeable and have a E-Stop Button (nice big red one).
10cents worth now.
Post by: G8B4Life on September 04, 2021, 11:33:19 PM
For what its worth, I like the loco picture on the main screen. It would be a boon if there was a graphics conversion element to the RailPro Assistant program so one could modify a photo and see what it would look like on the HC before going to the trouble of having to load it onto the HC/LM first.
You are aware that RPA does let you preview the loco picture you create? Not previewed with all the HC stuff around it but still a preview.
...But I also had a thought later on, what if there was also a new HC just for Operator's, the HC-3O (Operator ONLY) like you sorta get with the small Digitrax controller.
The problem with a "smaller" operator only HC is that it'd still cost about the same as the full fledged HC as it'd require all the same components (just in different sizes) to work; it'd still require a case, it'd still require a knob, it'd still require a touchscreen (not as expensive as you'd think) and it'd still require the same brains. I honestly couldn't see anyone buying them when the cost would be about the same as the full fledged HC.
- Tim
Post by: William Brillinger on September 05, 2021, 06:39:43 AM
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Not previewed with all the HC stuff around it but still a preview.
This is something that I could incorporate into the bitmap builder.
One day when my programmer needs something to do, I think we'll make this happen.
Post by: Gibs on September 05, 2021, 07:24:29 AM
I wouldn't have thought anyone would buy the smaller DigiTrax type controller's either, but they do. Its all about choices I suppose and what suits people's requirements best.
Post by: G8B4Life on September 05, 2021, 08:11:19 AM
This is something that I could incorporate into the bitmap builder.
One day when my programmer needs something to do, I think we'll make this happen.
That would be something to see. Too bad your programmer can't... oh wait, I can't go down that path :(
I wouldn't have thought anyone would buy the smaller DigiTrax type controller's either, but they do. Its all about choices I suppose and what suits people's requirements best.
People buy them because there is a significant cost advantage to them for their requirements. If the DigiTrax utility throttle cost the same as the full fledged DigiTrax DT602 no one would buy the utility throttle; well, I have a very hard time seeing anyone buying them because your getting less for the same cost. This is why I don't see it working for RP because the hardware requirements for a utility type throttle for RP are the same as for the full fledged HC so I don't see that there'd be any cost advantage to be had.
- Tim
Post by: ron045 on September 05, 2021, 08:29:21 AM
Post by: William Brillinger on September 05, 2021, 08:37:03 AM
Post by: ron045 on September 05, 2021, 08:44:26 AM
Volume and price. The 3rd party has got to determine what their market it for this mod AND who is capable to install and willing to pay for it.
The person doing the mod MUST be capable and not the ordinary user. Have a pro do the install makes the cost even higher and discourages users from doing the Mod.
Since Ring is soliciting ideas, I just thought wouldn't this be a great time to consider a ergonomic modification.
Maybe not....
Ron
Post by: G8B4Life on September 05, 2021, 08:51:02 AM
- Major circuit board redesign (though a circuit board redesign would be required for any slimming of the case width).
- By extending the length of the controller in that fashion your moving the one-handed-thumb control away from either the throttle knob or the usual horn button.
Bill, I had thought about a 3d printed case but it's pretty full on inside the HC, the circuit board is full width all the way from the top to where the case tapers in at the sides.
- Tim
Post by: ron045 on September 05, 2021, 09:01:19 AM
- By extending the length of the controller in that fashion your moving the one-handed-thumb control away from either the throttle knob or the usual horn button.
- Tim
You guys operate one handed? I have some pretty big hands and do not feel like I have a good grip on the HC and at the same time try to navigate my thumb around for throttle or touch buttons.
Post by: G8B4Life on September 05, 2021, 09:56:44 AM
You guys operate one handed?
Myself, yes and no. Due to my utter lack of having anywhere to run trains I've never really used my HC for any length of time to come to any concrete conclusion of how I use it but generally I've always used it one handed (and yes, I usually feel like I don't have a total hold of it) but I know others here do use the HC one handed all the time.
Thinking about it, in addition to being able to attach a lanyard I think a hand strap, like what's on those grip-ball toys, would be very handy.
Image credit: walmart.ca
- Tim
Post by: Dean on October 24, 2021, 03:40:54 AM
I hold the controller in my left hand and operate the throttle with my thumb. Button pushing is done with my right hand. But I don't do much button pushing once the train is running.
Post by: TwinStar on October 25, 2021, 11:03:29 PM
Tim
I wouldn't have thought anyone would buy the smaller DigiTrax type controller's either, but they do. Its all about choices I suppose and what suits people's requirements best.
I did. I bought a UT6D and I plan to buy another 3-4 of them. My module set (Dallas Union Terminal) will require 3-4 switching jobs and those will be handled by a fleet of SW power. As the main benefit to RailPro is the auto load sharing, there's no reason to do major surgery on a SW frame to run it by itself. I elected to install DCC into these units as well as the superior 567 sound files that are available. The UT6 sized throttle is perfect for an operator and something that I think is much, much better sized than the HC-2's that I have. In the 7 years that I've been using RailPro there isn't a single part of it that has gotten smaller. I'm certain the N scale guys have given up and I'm not about to ask my operators to deal with the massive HC-2 all day long. It isn't user friendly nor is it comfortable to hold. RailPro used to hold a major advantage over DCC in my opinion but today I see it as a 50/50 decision. Something needs to happen or this Betamax nitch product will be quickly surpassed.
Post by: GMM6809 on October 27, 2021, 12:53:14 AM
How about enabling the HC for video? Seriously, I had a vision (!) today of putting a camera in-engine, and seeing the output on the HC in real time. Lionel tried this decades ago but the tech is far better today. Actually, I'm surprised no one's done this with a phone.
I am actually trying to accomplish this. I haven’t figured out how to have the image display on a cell phone, but it does transmit wirelessly to a receiver and is sent to a TV via HDMI.
I want a cab ride video that is truest from the cab of the engine.
I fried my current camera and need to order a new one. I’ll ask electrical questions in another thread.
In regards to this topic, I’d love the dark screen look, and the lanyard loop.
Post by: ON28 on October 28, 2021, 09:37:49 PM