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RailPro => RailPro Specific Help & Discussion => Topic started by: emd_16645 on October 07, 2018, 11:20:35 AM

Title: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 07, 2018, 11:20:35 AM
I need to vent a little here.  I am getting absolutely fed up with the software side of RP.  Don't get me wrong, I love running with RP, the control setup is fantastic.  Its the computer stuff that is driving me up the wall.

When it comes to downloading software, be it basic applications like RP Assistant or HC Sim, or just sounds or photos, using Railpro has been nothing but hell for me.  As we went through  before, just simply setting up RPA and HC Sim was a six month ordeal.  I briefly got it functioning, got some sounds downloaded, and things were looking good.  Now HC Sim has completely tanked on me, first it would not connect to allow downloads from RPA.  Now its not recognizing the CI-1.  Since I have not purchased a HC-2, I'm completely dead in the water with Railpro.

I'm getting to the point where I dump my modest investment into RP and suck up dealing with DCC. The headaches with that aren't as bad as RP lately.  I know I need to call Ring and have a conversation with him, but I am to frustrated right now to have a decent talk.

Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 07, 2018, 11:55:54 AM
It sounds like your HC-Sim program somehow got corrupted. The first step is to talk to Ring, and likely he will recommend that you fully delete the HC software and do a fresh install. 

To do this you will need to delete the HC simulator folder found inside the Ring Engineering folder, on your hard drive.  You will also need to delete a hidden file, and the procedure for that depends on what version of Windows you are running.

Give us a little more information and remind us what the problem was with getting HC Sim working in the first place.  Let's see what we can do to help.

Frustration is totally understandable. But I'm sure we can figure this out and get everything working smoothly. Tim Ring will likely have some good suggestions as well. Either way I'm sure that you can fix this issue.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 07, 2018, 12:25:50 PM
My issues generally stem from the UDP reliance of RP. Since my internet is now provided through my cell phone, It doesnít play well.

Iím using a Windows 10 computer, which apparently doesnít play well. Could have had an update go through that killed HC sum.

Iím sure this can be worked through, itís just frustrating.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 07, 2018, 01:42:34 PM
My issues generally stem from the UDP reliance of RP. Since my internet is now provided through my cell phone, It doesnít play well.

Iím using a Windows 10 computer, which apparently doesnít play well. Could have had an update go through that killed HC sum.

Iím sure this can be worked through, itís just frustrating.

I know this doesn't help your situation and will be of little comfort, so just more as a so-you-are-aware response.

I too use Windows 10. Enterprise on one machine, Pro on another, and Home on yet another. Immaterial reasons why the differences. I can say with surety, at least in my case, RP works on all of them and no Windows updates to date have broken anything. The Enterprise machine has an extensive group policy arrangement yet RP still works. The Pro machine (my workhorse) has a tremendous amount of 3rd party software installed as well as many connected USB devices - printers, drives, scanner, drawing tablet, camera, etc. The Home machine is pretty basic with no external devices other than monitor.

My point is RP is known to work in varied Windows 10 environments. Unless you have some way out in left field Windows configuration I highly doubt Windows 10 or the updates is the reason for your troubles.

Let's talk about the Internet via cell phone shall we. I often create web apps for the clients of the company for which I work. Some of the apps are rather communication intensive relying on a lot of back and forth between the device and the server (AJAX). Guess where the vast majority of my complaint calls originate. You guessed it, people using cell phones to connect a computer to the Internet. They are usually in a meeting room at a hotel or some similar situation where they can't connect their laptop directly to wi-fi or a network. On the face of it everything should work yet I know from experience it often does not. Adding to their frustration is the fact that the web app may work fine on the phone in the instance but not on the connected computer. So in that regard I have a lot of empathy for Ring.

My experience with cellphone Internet connections for computers has shown them to be sporadic, problematic, and difficult to troubleshoot even when UDP is not in the picture.

Again, I know none of this helps you directly and yes, RP needs to step up their game with the software IMO. I say all this only so you know a) Windows 10 is likely not the problem; b) computer connectivity via cellphone often causes problems for more than just RP.

Keep the faith, brother.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 07, 2018, 03:18:29 PM
Thanks for the input Alan. There really isnít anything special setup wise for my computer. Realistically I donít even use it that much.

Regarding the cell phone internet. I really donít expect it to work on the cell phone network, I donít even try. Right now, besides RP itís covering my needs without the substantial added cost of a home network. So financially a cable or dialup connection isnít in the cards.  However, I do expect everything to function properly when I take my computer elsewhere and connect via WiFi. Unfortunately this doesnít allow me to control network settings or such, but that really shouldnít be a requirement.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 07, 2018, 04:57:10 PM
If you take a computer somewhere that has a wifi network available, there is a good chance that the network is set up so that won't let you download through RPA.  That shouldn't affect the HC-Sim though.  That should connect to RPA whether or not you are connected to the internet, and it should connect to the CI-1 regardless of internet access.  So if the HC-Sim is not connecting to either one then it sounds like a HC-Sim problem, and not an internet problem.  Unless you meant to say RPA was the problem?

I'm also running Windows 10 and RPA/Hc-Sim work fine.  Before the latest HC-Sim was released my laptop would not recognize my CI-1 due some software I have installed for work purposes.  It all works fine now.

Out of curiosity what version of RPA/HC-Sim are you running?

-Kevin
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 07, 2018, 06:51:38 PM
A random thought...

You don't happen to use one of those dastardly "Registry Cleaners" or "PC Tune Up" software do you? They are often bundled with anti-virus software and usually (almost always) cause more problems than they cure.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 08, 2018, 06:15:20 AM
Yes, Iím aware that other connection points can be locked down. However two locations Iíve tried and his week Iíve successfully used in the past. Obviously something could have changed.

I wiped the Railpro folders earlier this week and reinstalled from rings site. It appears the RPA has been working 100% fine. It states itís connected to internet and everything is accessible (sounds, etc). The problem is when updating files to the HC it refuses to connect.

Alan, no I havenít downloaded any such files. Iím aware of the problems they cause. I really donít use the computer often, just for Railpro and occasionally Train Simulator run.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 08, 2018, 06:48:58 AM
Let me work through this so I know exactly where we're at.

You wiped the RailPro folders. There are folders in C:\ProgramData\ and C:\Program Files\ for both RPA and HC Sim. Did you wipe all the folders?

You downloaded and reinstalled RPA and HC Sim from Rings site. What version do they report as being?

When both RPA and HC Sim are running, does RPA report that USB is connected?

HC Sim can not see the CI-1 correct?

- Tim


Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 08, 2018, 08:25:26 AM
Let me work through this so I know exactly where we're at.

You wiped the RailPro folders. There are folders in C:\ProgramData\ and C:\Program Files\ for both RPA and HC Sim. Did you wipe all the folders?

You downloaded and reinstalled RPA and HC Sim from Rings site. What version do they report as being?

When both RPA and HC Sim are running, does RPA report that USB is connected?

HC Sim can not see the CI-1 correct?

- Tim

I wiped the program files, did not wipe the data.

RPA is reporting version 3.21, HC Sim software SW1021 1.31.

RPA indicates USB connection, HC sim does not.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 08, 2018, 08:38:49 AM
Your HC-Sim is way out of date.  It should be 2.05, not 1.31.  That right there may be part of the problem.

The other part may be that the data files need to be erased as well in order to do a clean install.  You'll have to enable hidden folders on your C drive to get to it, then go in there and delete the folders inside Ring Engineering. 

*****If you want to keep any of your downloaded files in RPA you must copy and paste the "Railpro Assistant Storage" somewhere else.  Once you reinstall you can drag and drop that file back in and all your old sounds files will show up in RPA.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 08, 2018, 08:45:06 AM
Iíve removed the HC sim files from both program files and data. I will try reloading from Ring tomorrow when I have WiFi access. If that doesnít solve my issues I will do the same for RPA. I donít have any custom files so Iím not concerned about the data files. I can just redownload.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 08, 2018, 08:52:27 AM
If you would like one of us to send you the program install files I'm sure we could.  That way you wouldn't have to wait for Wifi access.  Just a thought.

I would still backup your Railpro Assistant Storage file.  The files can indeed be redownloaded, but when you are downloading prime mover files it takes quite a while.  If you already have some of those downloaded now, there is no need to have to do it again.

-Kevin
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 09, 2018, 05:51:05 AM
HC Sim software SW1021 1.31.

That is a mystery. 1.31 is not the version that I had previously provided for you to download with the offline installer way back in March.

We need to get you on to HC Sim version 2.05. All previous versions have a bug that can prevent HC Sim from detecting the CI-1 (there's probably a good story there about solving that bug if I could be bothered writing it). If you can not get it installed from Rings site let us know and we'll get it to you.

It sounds like RPA is functioning correctly, it indicates USB connected when HC Sim is running and indicates the internet is connected and you can browse the available files and 3.21 is the latest version. I'd suggest not deleting RPA, the problem is not with it.

Once your on to HC Sim 2.05 and if you still can not download then we'll work on that.

*****If you want to keep any of your downloaded files in RPA you must copy and paste the "Railpro Assistant Storage" somewhere else.  Once you reinstall you can drag and drop that file back in and all your old sounds files will show up in RPA.

Just a fair warning for everyone, it's not quite as simple as that. The storage file contains all the screens and buttons that RPA uses, along with any files you download. If there's has been any changes to any screens or buttons in RPA and you copy the "backed up" storage file over the new storage file you will loose the changes and possibly cause RPA to function incorrectly, if at all. The same goes for HC Sim and it's storage file as well.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 09, 2018, 06:36:48 AM
HC Sim software SW1021 1.31.

That is a mystery. 1.31 is not the version that I had previously provided for you to download with the offline installer way back in March.

We need to get you on to HC Sim version 2.05. All previous versions have a bug that can prevent HC Sim from detecting the CI-1 (there's probably a good story there about solving that bug if I could be bothered writing it). If you can not get it installed from Rings site let us know and we'll get it to you.

It sounds like RPA is functioning correctly, it indicates USB connected when HC Sim is running and indicates the internet is connected and you can browse the available files and 3.21 is the latest version. I'd suggest not deleting RPA, the problem is not with it.

Once your on to HC Sim 2.05 and if you still can not download then we'll work on that.

- Tim

That follows my line of thinking.  I will have wifi access this afternoon and we will see how it goes. I'll PM you for the offline installer if I have no luck.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 09, 2018, 03:00:59 PM
Tim,

Got internet access and have HC Sim 2.05 running from the link you sent me previously.  Direct download was problematic.  Got some sounds downloading for now.

How do I update HC Sim to 2.09?  I haven't figured that part out yet.

Thanks for the help.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 09, 2018, 03:07:16 PM
The current version for HC-Sim is 2.05. 

The current version for the LM-3S is 2.09. 

The versions are specific to the piece of hardware...they do not all match up.  Originally everything was 2.00 when the last major update was released, but since then some products have had more updates than other.  The LM-3S has had more updates than the HC.

-Kevin
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 09, 2018, 03:29:27 PM
Thanks for clarifying.  I thought I read that HC Sim was up to 2.09.  My bad.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 09, 2018, 07:48:48 PM
Ok, I have another gripe (you may slap me now).  Is it just me, or is the HC Sim/CI-1 plain stupid?  I sat down and loaded a bunch of sounds to the CI-1 this afternoon.  Now I go to load a LM3S, and there literally are no files there.  Secondly, it seems the HC Sim is constantly forgetting settings.  Locomotive names, pictures, etc. are all fair game to be forgotten.  Its like periodically it jumps back to a previous setting.  Is this avoidable?
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 09, 2018, 08:34:39 PM
<slap>

The CI-1 is nothing more than a transmitter/receiver. There is no loading anything to it. It sounds like you may have it confused with a USB memory stick.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 09, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
<slap>

The CI-1 is nothing more than a transmitter/receiver. There is no loading anything to it. It sounds like you may it confused with a USB memory stick.

Thanks. I figured it had to work in that way due to the way it seemed to work. RPA shows the files on my computer, but HC Sim isnít recognizing them. I canít transfer them because the HC Sim is insisting on internet access again 🙄
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: TwinStar on October 09, 2018, 11:58:42 PM
<slap>

The CI-1 is nothing more than a transmitter/receiver. There is no loading anything to it. It sounds like you may it confused with a USB memory stick.

Thanks. I figured it had to work in that way due to the way it seemed to work. RPA shows the files on my computer, but HC Sim isnít recognizing them. I canít transfer them because the HC Sim is insisting on internet access again 🙄

Don't take this the wrong way...

I sat down a few months ago to update several LM's. I hadn't used HC-Sim and RPA in some time so I was going by memory. I'm a long time RailPro user and I know what I'm doing. 15 minutes into it and I'm cussing at my computer and Tim Ring at the same time. I finally got the user manual up online and started reading. I was doing it bass ackwards the whole time. Once I started doing things correctly it worked like a charm.

Long story, quick question: Are you following the steps in the correct order?
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 10, 2018, 12:20:57 AM
Lol, done that myself too.   :D
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 10, 2018, 06:58:31 AM
you may slap me now

I'm not going to slap you, your safe from that  ;D

First things first, now that you have HC Sim 2.05 installed does it recognise the CI-1 as "installed" when HC Sim is running and you can use HC Sim to access and control your locomotive?

HC Sim doesn't access the internet. Even though the update screen says "Waiting for Internet", it's actually communicating with RPA.

From the sounds of it you do have the procedure correct for downloading files as you said that you were downloading some sounds just a couple of posts back but we'll check anyway.

Both RPA and HC Sim are running at the same time when you try to download.
You do have a file in the "Download list to Handheld Controller" area in RPA.

What error message is shown when you say HC Sim "insists on internet access"? I'm guessing the error message you are seeing in HC Sim is one that says "Cannot Connect" after the "Waiting for Internet" screen? This would indicate RPA is not running.

As for HC Sim forgetting stuff, you can try running HC Sim with administrator privileges. You shouldn't need to but if something on your PC has decided that HC Sim has no right to write to the hard disk then changes in HC Sim (downloads, renamed locomotives etc) will be lost upon closing HC Sim.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 11:13:17 AM

Don't take this the wrong way...


No worries, I have a thick skin.  I can be pretty dumb when it comes to this, so a thick skin is necessary.

First things first, now that you have HC Sim 2.05 installed does it recognise the CI-1 as "installed" when HC Sim is running and you can use HC Sim to access and control your locomotive?

Yes, I can access and control locomotives now.

HC Sim doesn't access the internet. Even though the update screen says "Waiting for Internet", it's actually communicating with RPA.

From the sounds of it you do have the procedure correct for downloading files as you said that you were downloading some sounds just a couple of posts back but we'll check anyway.

Both RPA and HC Sim are running at the same time when you try to download.
You do have a file in the "Download list to Handheld Controller" area in RPA.

Yes, that list is shown in RPA.  I added the files I wanted to the list, then used HC Sim to Update software.  Everything seemed to work as expected, except when I got home there were no files on the HC Sim.

What error message is shown when you say HC Sim "insists on internet access"? I'm guessing the error message you are seeing in HC Sim is one that says "Cannot Connect" after the "Waiting for Internet" screen? This would indicate RPA is not running.

Yes, when I am not connected to the internet, I get the "Waiting for Internet" on the HC followed by "Cannot Connect".

As for HC Sim forgetting stuff, you can try running HC Sim with administrator privileges. You shouldn't need to but if something on your PC has decided that HC Sim has no right to write to the hard disk then changes in HC Sim (downloads, renamed locomotives etc) will be lost upon closing HC Sim.

- Tim


That is a very interesting point.  My computer has not liked running RP programs, it sees them as a security risk.  I will try using HC Sim in admin mode and see if I get better results.

The question is, how can I get HC Sim to draw files shown as on the computer in RPA when there is not a connection to the internet?
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 10, 2018, 11:22:16 AM
Quote
That is a very interesting point.  My computer has not liked running RP programs, it sees them as a security risk.  I will try using HC Sim in admin mode and see if I get better results.

It is my understanding you must always run RP software in Admin mode (at least I always have) because the software writes to the C:Program Files directory. It is a good thing Windows requires authentication before allowing software to write there. Not doing so would present a huge security risk.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 11:30:35 AM
Quote
That is a very interesting point.  My computer has not liked running RP programs, it sees them as a security risk.  I will try using HC Sim in admin mode and see if I get better results.

It is my understanding you must always run RP software in Admin mode (at least I always have) because the software writes to the C:Program Files directory. It is a good thing Windows requires authentication before allowing software to write there. Not doing so would present a huge security risk.

I'm not complaining about the security, and I agree its a good thing.  However, I think it is foolish for Rind to setup his software to rely on the program files.  That's just one more area that can use improvement.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 10, 2018, 12:08:17 PM
Be sure that when you are trying to transfer file to the HC-Sim that you are actually selecting files that are on the computer currently.  If you are selecting files from the upper row of buttons then you are downloading them from the Ring server.  You must select the lower row of buttons to use files from the computer. 

I just turned off all internet connection, wireless and otherwise, and confirmed that I can download local files from RPA on the to HC-Sim without having to be connected to the internet.

If the HC-Sim is showing "waiting for internet", it is really just saying that it's waiting for a response from RPA....nothing to do with the internet in this case.  Does RPA show that the HC-Sim is connected when you have both programs opened up?  If not, close HC-Sim and open it again and see if that makes a difference.

-Kevin
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 02:19:40 PM
Opened both in admin mode and transfer between RPA and HC Sim appears to be running fine without internet. Iím happy itís working but itís so frustrating too.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 10, 2018, 02:42:00 PM
Operating Rail Pro and landing rockets... same skill set.

read.png
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 03:15:00 PM
Operating Rail Pro and landing rockets... same skill set.

Whoíd have guessed?
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 06:28:00 PM
Annnnnnd running HC Sim in admin mode does not protect files saved to the HC from being wiped.  Reload....
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 10, 2018, 06:43:26 PM
Annnnnnd running HC Sim in admin mode does not protect files saved to the HC from being wiped.  Reload....

Did you assign unique names to HC Sim and your HC? (pg4 in HC Sim manual)

Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 06:56:30 PM
Annnnnnd running HC Sim in admin mode does not protect files saved to the HC from being wiped.  Reload....

Did you assign unique names to HC Sim and your HC? (pg4 in HC Sim manual)

No?  But I currently only have the HC Sim. I have not purchased a handheld yet.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 10, 2018, 07:03:57 PM
Annnnnnd running HC Sim in admin mode does not protect files saved to the HC from being wiped.  Reload....

You referenced HC hence why I asked. Sounds like you are saying files are not being saved when you close and relaunch HC Sim, correct?
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 07:10:42 PM
Annnnnnd running HC Sim in admin mode does not protect files saved to the HC from being wiped.  Reload....

You referenced HC hence why I asked. Sounds like you are saying files are not being saved when you close and relaunch HC Sim, correct?

I was being lazy referring to HC. My apologies. Actually Iíve had HC Sim crash a couple times when loading a file, so closing wasnít voluntary. Iím halfway through retrying and will post a screen shot if unsuccessful.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 07:44:59 PM
Fail.

https://flic.kr/p/29a5A9b (https://flic.kr/p/29a5A9b)
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 10, 2018, 08:27:10 PM
Wow, that screen looks very odd. What's with the "exit" and "information" hanging out in space? Those should be tied to a button. There are some serious issues going on with the program here.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 10, 2018, 08:40:03 PM
I agree. The words there arenít buttons, they are just words. Have to close and restart. Note this is only a been a problem when trying to load the 710 ULT file to the LM3S.

Also I have to say most of the issues so far Iíve had can be tied to user error. This definitely is a software bug. I ought to shoot this one off to ring.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 10, 2018, 09:08:21 PM
Yeah, that is very odd. Corrupted file(s) for sure.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 10, 2018, 10:31:41 PM
It is my understanding you must always run RP software in Admin mode (at least I always have) because the software writes to the C:Program Files directory.

RPA and HC Sim haven't used C:\Program Files as a writable location since at least version 2. They both now use C:\ProgramData for a writable location. C:\ProgramData is supposed to be an all-user all-access location for just that purpose but that doesn't mean that things don't go wrong and some programs get write access denied. Running as admin can usually get around that but not always. This is starting to sound like a permissions issue, though there may be more to it that that.

Chris, if you can remember when you were downloading the sounds from Ring you would have seen the "Waiting for Internet screen" in HC Sim and the percent indicator in RPA counting up to 100%. When RPA finished downloading did you see the the "Copying Files" screen in HC Sim and the two percentage complete progress bars complete? If you did then HC Sim is working correctly in this regard and the files were copied to HC Sim. The fact they were not there later does indicates that HC Sim is unable to write it's in-memory copy of the storage file back to disk. That is not a HC Sim bug but a Windows issue.

That funky error screen, I've seen similar to that before. I think I remember some of the reasons but I'll have to check. I'll be back later today with some things to check.

- Tim




Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 11, 2018, 02:09:40 AM
Well one quick experiment later and I was able to crash HC Sim to a funky screen. Not the same screen and not doing the same thing as Chris but crash it with a funky screen none the less, by running HC Sim 2.05 with 1.31's screen files instead of 2.05 screen files.

Chris, just to check this off, which of the following Software Update screens does your HC Sim look like?

hc sim 131 software update.png
HC Sim 1.31 update screen

hc sim 205 software update.png
HC Sim 2.05 update screen

I'm still working on some other things to check.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 03:59:10 AM
I am running 2.05, I removed all earlier files so any 1.31 files should be gone. To be clear, this error only occurred when loading the 710 ULT file. I successfully loaded a photo and all other needed sounds (horn, bell, etc). Only the one file was a problem. Maybe Iím hitting some form of memory limit?

When loading to HC Sim it cycled through the percentage bars twice.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 11, 2018, 07:01:01 AM
You think your running 2.05 but... Ok, you most likely are running all of 2.05, as you didn't pipe up and say "hey, the software update screen still looks like 1.31" but I had to ask, in Windows there is a thing called File and System Virtulisation in which if a program can not write to a system folder (like Program Files and apparently ProgramData too) Windows will redirect everything to a folder in which it can write to and use that forever after, even if you put newer files into the folder it was supposed to use in the first place. It was a long shot but 1.31's screen files could have still existed in that virtual folder and the 2.05 program could have been using them, even though it'd still be reporting it's version as 2.05.

I don't think your hitting the memory limit, unless you've got a whole lot loaded into the LM already. I've got one with two ULT prime mover files, one ULT horn and the generic prime mover, bell and horn that come pre installed loaded into it. From memory you get a not enough space error when trying to copy something bigger than the remaining space into an LM.

I've gotten the cannot connect error before when copying to an LM, and also tonight when copying an ULT prime mover. In both cases I just moved the CI-1 a bit closer and it all went fine next time. Didn't get a funky screen though.

It might be best to just get you the storage file ready-to-go just to rule out anything wrong with it though it'd be a large download at around 30 Megabytes.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 11, 2018, 07:14:12 AM
... I just moved the CI-1 a bit closer and it all went fine next time.
- Tim

I don't own a CI-1 but it must have a very limited range. In the manual it specifically recommends moving the CI-1 to a central location relatively close to the layout, recommends using a USB cable to get the CI-1 away from the computer itself, and specifically calls out using other Ring products as repeaters. The fact that Tim chose to spell all this out in the manual means the CI-1 must have a rather short range. Sounds real similar to mice and keyboard USB transceivers.

Chris, given all the problems you are experiencing you may want to make sure you have the CI-1 very close to your LMs when operating/moving files/etc.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 07:44:15 AM
Well, I did have the laptop sitting in the yard a couple of feet from the loco.  But I can move it closer.

And to confirm Tim, the download screen matched the 2.05 screenshot, not the 1.31 you posted.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 11, 2018, 07:59:38 AM
If you have on hand a USB cable use it to move the CI-1 away from the computer itself. (refer pg3 of the manual)
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 11, 2018, 08:22:12 AM
It would be interesting to find out what the useful range of the CI-1 is. I have successfully used it to copy files to an LM over 10 feet away through a wall, but they were small files (pictures and light effects). Both times I got the cannot connect message was with copying large files like prime mover files (and tonight the CI-1 was only about 12 inches from the LM and the copying was about half way through). I guess the reason to have the CI-1 so close when copying is to have the best signal strength possible. While the power output of the CI-1 is probably decent I imagine it's not in the same league as the wireless router etc that would be used in a home.

Chris, thanks for the clarification. I'm still at a loss as to the funky screen when HC Sim crashed but I'm working on it. I'm still working on checking permissions as well for the HC Sim looses downloaded files etc problem. I don't have Win10 so I have to find out how to check folder permissions in Win10 first, it's probably different to other versions of Windows. Let us know how you go with the CI-1 closer to the LM when copying the 710 ULT engine file. Be aware that you might not be able to use the ULT engine without updating the LM's product program first.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 08:26:58 AM
Tim, I will report back tonight.  The LM3S is on version 2.07.  I have successfully used the FDL ULT file on this chip (since removed).  I do need to update the LM3S to 2.09 so I can use the ULT horn files.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 02:49:13 PM
I guess this wasnít close enough...

https://www.flickr.com/gp/33511925@N05/5twE3R (https://www.flickr.com/gp/33511925@N05/5twE3R)
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 11, 2018, 03:13:39 PM
The loco is sitting on powered rails, right? Can't see track under it in your photo.

BTW Don't set a laptop on powered train track. The invisible-to-the-naked-eye coatings applied to laptop/tablet/phone cases are electrically conductive (in a high resistance way) to protect the sensitive electronic innards from static electricity discharge. The company I work for makes the coatings. Our customer list includes component suppliers to virtually every brand device you have ever heard of. Not that sitting a laptop on train track is going to unleash hell's fury, it's just not a good idea to do so.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 11, 2018, 04:57:18 PM
Agreed with what Alan said regarding laptops on track.  I've done that and it fails every time.  I typically will set it on a book on the track.

You absolutely need to send this to Tim Ring.  He needs to see that screen and what is going on here.  My guess is that a file somehow got corrupted and is wreaking havoc with your HC-Sim. 

I had a HC-2 that had something similar go wrong (screens were going haywire), and it was because I had been beta testing and some of the old beta code corrupted and could not be fixed by updating with new code.  I had to send the HC back for a complete wipe and factory reset.  All is well now.  In your situation you *should* be able to get a completely fresh install by fully deleting everything.  Not sure why this is still showing up.

-Kevin
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 05:03:51 PM
So I did more testing tonight. I was able to successfully load the 645 ULT file using the same arraignment. That suggests a file issue with the 710 ULT. Either something compatibility wise or a corrupted file.

Iíll try to put together an email for Ring.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 11, 2018, 05:15:46 PM
So I did more testing tonight. I was able to successfully load the 645 ULT file using the same arraignment. That suggests a file issue with the 710 ULT. Either something compatibility wise or a corrupted file.

Iíll try to put together an email for Ring.

That's progress.  Interesting....I guess the 710 ULT may have gotten corrupted somehow during transfer?  I've never had that happen but I suppose it's possible.

Give Tim as much information as possible, including all the pictures you took.  He will likely ask for additional details to be sure he finds the source of the problem.  It'll get fixed.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 06:05:05 PM
So another discovery. I decided to try again (Iím bored tonight). As usual had to rediscover the LM3 and such. While waiting I fired up a DCC loco and started fiddling in the yard. Bonehead me picks a switch shorting out the system. What do I see on the computer, but the same error. The plot thickens...
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 11, 2018, 06:20:41 PM
Dang, you just can't catch a break.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 07:07:26 PM
Dang, you just can't catch a break.

Break earned. So after the last discovery, I opted to try again. Ensuring the computer was not placed on the rails, I tried once more. Success!  So what must have happened was a transfer fault due to the placement of the computer. So, inadvertently it appears user error strikes again. On the plus side, Iíve got both of my current RP projects 100% programed so no more monkeying around for awhile.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 11, 2018, 07:26:37 PM
Good to hear it!  Glad you got things working for now.

As a side note, I had a locomotive I was updating to 2.09 and it failed over and over again.  Close to the end of the upload "cannot connect" would come up and I'd have to start again.  What I eventually found out was that the locomotive didn't have enough space to allow the update and subsequent updating of files.  It didn't show "insufficient space" because it didn't account for the extra space needed to process the update.  Simply removing an unneeded sound did the trick.  Update worked the first time after that.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 07:28:27 PM
That 2.09 update is still needed. But I can manage with out for now.

Now I need to finish the locomotive build.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: G8B4Life on October 11, 2018, 07:46:48 PM
That's great news Chris. Before the 2.09 update we'll have to solve why HC Sim is loosing files and settings as product programs don't get saved locally to RPA, only to HC Sim (or the handheld if you had one of those) and with HC Sim loosing stuff when you close it (I presume it's still doing that) you'd have to keep the laptop on and HC Sim running all the way home from your Wi-Fi spot just to keep it in HC Sim!

Kevin, That's interesting if the update process works that way. It reminds me of when a member here could not get RPA to save their feature enable. Turned out there simply was not enough free space in RPA to save the file. Deleting some files did the trick but no useful information was returned by RPA to give indication that there was not enough free space.

- Tim
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: Alan on October 11, 2018, 08:01:15 PM
Seems very odd the software would not query available space before copying a file. That seems like such a trivial and elementary programming element.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: KPack on October 11, 2018, 08:09:01 PM
Seems very odd the software would not query available space before copying a file. That seems like such a trivial and elementary programming element.

It does, but I think the updates work differently.  You need more space on the module for large updates, but most of the space is freed up when the update is done.  I'm not totally sure how it works but I believe the extra space usage is to unpack the new files, rearrange what is necessary, and overwrite old files.  The actual data size of the update is small, but the space required to apply the update is large...or something like that.
Title: Re: Beyond Frustrated with Railpro
Post by: emd_16645 on October 11, 2018, 09:03:03 PM
That's great news Chris. Before the 2.09 update we'll have to solve why HC Sim is loosing files and settings as product programs don't get saved locally to RPA, only to HC Sim (or the handheld if you had one of those) and with HC Sim loosing stuff when you close it (I presume it's still doing that) you'd have to keep the laptop on and HC Sim running all the way home from your Wi-Fi spot just to keep it in HC Sim.

- Tim

Fortunately RPA is storing files onto the computer. Therefore HC sim closing isnít the end of the world, I just have to load each file back into HC Sim before transferring to the LM3S. A little bit of lost time but Iím up and running. At this point I have not invested in a HC-2 (I only have 3 chips in the first place) so HC Sim is what I have. I saw your PM, Iíll try to get to it this weekend.