Author Topic: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000  (Read 765 times)

Tom

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2021, 05:11:24 PM »
If anyone could help again, it would be very much appreciated.

I now have all the supplies, tools and components: I just need to find out what to do with them.  The locomotive has up front so to say, a motor, a headlight and a MARS light.  If there is anything else I have no idea what it might be.

See the attached wiring diagram.  It has the numbered labels that are on the circuit board from which wires run into the locomotive.  Given the labels (I do not know if the numbers mean anything) I think the M+ and M- are going to the motor, COM is the common + wire, and FL- is the front light.  That leaves MATHS, R+ and L- unknown as to where these wires go and what they are for.

Does anyone have any ideas as to which one is the MARS light and what the other two are for?  If I figure out which one is the MARS light can I just forget about the other two?

I am thinking that the only way to run the tender light is to put a splice in the Ring blue common wire and run one to the COMM on the circuit board gong to the locomotive and one to the tender light.  Is this correct?

nodcc4me

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2021, 07:12:27 PM »
The blue wire needs to connect to all three lights, so yes, splice it and run it to the tender bulb. You can use either the green or violet outputs from the 6-pin plug for the mars light and the tender. You will set the wire color for each of the lights in the HC after the wiring is finished.
Al

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Tom

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2021, 03:44:26 PM »
Thanks Al.

That solves one part of the problem.  I have still not figured out what the wires attached to the circuit board labeled as MTHS, R+ and L- are for, let alone which one might be for the MARS light.  But I have come up with another idea you might be able to weigh in on.

The QSI Quantum System decoder in the locomotive works either with DC or DCC.  When operating on DC the lights and sounds (there many) operate when power is applied.  Two other more or less essential sounds are the whistle and bell.  These are activated by manipulating the power pack directional switch in certain sequences and usually has to be done quickly to avoid losing power.  Both the LM-3S and the original decoder will fit in the tender and quite likely a KA if needed.  The only things that might cause a power loss to the decoder would be the HC-2 or the LM-3S.

I am thinking that I can connect the Ring WH-9 wiring harness red and black wires to the wires coming from the track power pickups and the orange and gray wires to the 2 Pin connector on the decoder circuit board (where the power gets to the decoder).  RailPro is DC, so this way I would be controlling power to the original decoder via the HC-2 using only the directional button and the throttle; basically operating the locomotive in DC mode.  The original decoder would not know the difference, right?

Tom

nodcc4me

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2021, 04:32:09 PM »
Tom, I understand what you are trying to do, but I'm not sure that will work because the orange and gray wires should go to the motor inputs. My familiarity with DCC is somewhat limited, but from the features you mentioned, the LM3-S should be able to handle all of them. I have just removed the DCC board and wired all the lights and sounds directly to the module. I have removed a few DCC boards and done it that way.
Al

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faithie999

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2021, 05:15:46 PM »
would R+ be "right rail, +15v", and L- be "left rail, -15v"?

Carter

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2021, 07:15:58 AM »
https://www.ringengineering.com/RailPro/Documents/LM-3Instructions.pdf

LM-3S wire diagram.



personally, I would not want to re-install the original board. so with that said cut the wires to all plugs 1/2-3/4 inch long remove board and wire in LM-3S, soldering the wires. To re-install original board, cut leads to LM-3S remove re-solder the wires leads to the original board leads. no trying to fine their mate plugs and wiring that to an LM-3S.

My 2 cents. carter

Carter

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2021, 07:26:04 AM »
Also see the diagram for LED lites with resistor(s). why add incandescent bulbs???

Carter

trainman605

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2021, 09:20:44 AM »
I guess for myself I just don't understand the dual operating systems, or have two systems under one control. I'm talking DCC and RaiPro together, for me it's one or the other. I will say here that I have NCE DCC in my HOn3 layout and I'm totally happy with how it works and all the features it has, as I am with the RailPro battery power in my G Scale layout. I guess we all have our reasons for dual systems, for me I see no reason to go with both, I will say here I have watched KPack's videos on YouTube and I do like how his system works, I have no idea if he has DCC in his loco's along with his RailPro as I only watched his videos for the RaiPro features and programing.

trainman

KPack

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2021, 12:31:21 PM »
trainman - I have no DCC in any of my locomotives (except for Railpro's built-in DCC mode).  Everything is Railpro.

And faithie999, I would concur with the others.....it is far easier to just remove the factory board and hardwire in the LM-3S.  Far less potential for issues as well (signal loss, power interruption, etc).  The less components you have between the LM-3S and the end of the wire, the better.  Cleaner is simpler.

-Kevin

Tom

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #24 on: April 14, 2021, 02:03:12 PM »
UPDATE: after much head scratching, many false starts and waiting for JST connectors from China.

CONTROLLING DECODER WITH LM-2S – Locomotive runs fine as originally configured using PWR-56 (though no control of speed or direction) with or WITHOUT the 2 pin power pickup attached to the decoder in either direction with all lights and sounds functioning properly.  With an LM-2S inserted between either power pickup (loco or tender) there were some wiring connections that resulted in shorts and some where nothing happened and no shorts.  With two other wire configurations I was able to control only the locomotive speed and direction with the LM-2S, sounds and lights did not function.
Finally, with the wires attached as shown, the locomotive functioned properly as it does on DC powered track with all lights and sounds functioning properly using the LM-2S for feeding power – for about 10 seconds.  After a few minutes it will work again for about 10 seconds.  When it stops working the Info. message is “Motor Over Peak Current.”  The motor works fine with PWR-56 only, but with the LM-2S installed the LM-2S thinks there is a motor problem.  I upped the previous MFLC setting on the LM-2S manually from 190 to 400, and it now runs well with all the locomotive sounds and lights.  The loco sounds are probably better than Rings, with auto break squealing and reduced chuffing sound when slowing down, among others.
Unfortunately the whistle and bell do not work.  The bell and whistle in DC mode are turned on and off by reversing very quickly the directional control so as not to lose power while doing so.  Changing the directional control on the HC-2 loses power long enough to stop these functions.  Probably will run for a while as is just to get the feel of it and then remove the original decoded and install the LM-2S.

LM-2S INSTALLATION – I do not think that I should have a problem wiring in the LM-2S, or a 3S if one of those is needed to get Heavy Steam sound with one exception: do I need resistors for the three lights?  Can anyone tell from looking at the original photo I posted earlier whether resisters are needed or not?  There are not any of the typical looking resistors one buys, but there may be something on the decoder that someone more experience than I would recognize as one.
Thanks for any comments.
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Tom

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Re: INSTALLING LM-3S in PROTO 2-000
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2021, 08:50:42 PM »
Folks,

Never mind the question: I have found out that the tiny rectangular black things on the decoder are likely to be resistors.  In worst case it appears that installing a resistor will not hurt, and if lights do not work they can always be removed.