Auto Reversing Module

[dfischer71]

I'm new to model railroading and am laying track on my new layout.  I have a place with two parallel tracks.  I have a double crossover connecting those two tracks.  If trains go straight thru either side of the crossover, then I don't think there is a power issue.

But if they cross over, then apparently that creates a reverse loop.  So, that means the point where the power hits the wrong polarity will be at each corner of the crossover. 

So, if that makes sense, how do I install the AR-1?  Will one unit handle all four issues or do I need four AR-1s? I am very confused, obviously. 

I have seen info about needing room for the whole train inside the loop, but in this case the loop appears to be from one side of the crossover to the other which is only a few inches.

How close to the crossover do I attach the wires for the AR-1?  -- dont know what else to ask a at this point.  Thanks in advance.

Dan

[melarson]

It does not appear to me, given the information you have stated, that you have created a reverse loop.  However, to better help you, would it be possible for you to post a drawing or sketch of your track plan?  We could then be more definitive as to your need for an AR-1.

You can determine if you have a reverse loop by following a train around on your plan.  If the train passes a point in one direction, then some time later passes that same point (same track) going the opposite direction, then you do have a reverse loop.  In your case you also need to trace a train going in one direction on one of your parallel tracks and determine if later it passes next to that point on the other parallel track, but traveling in the opposite direction.  A good point of reference in your case would be the location of your crossover.  If so, again you have a reverse loop.

Again a drawing would be best.  Where you should locate gaps and connect the AR-1 is determined by your plan.

[dfischer71]

Michael,

I appreciate your taking the time to help me with this.  I am almost embarrassed to even upload this sketch!  When I discovered a few days ago that I might have a reverse loop, I drew this pen and pencil sketch of the whole layout so I could tell where my "lines" crossed.  My sketch is too big to provide a copy of the whole thing on one page since my scanner size is limited.  However, this is the part that is relevant.  I have made some circled numbers to make it easier for me to describe.  Each track is depicted with two lines - a blue one and a pencil one.

Starting in area 1 - A train would come out of the storage area (bottom right SE corner) and proceed up that Eastern most track and it would loop around and come back down almost to the place where it started.  So I can go any direction, and due to limited space, I put in a double crossover.  I pencilled a circle around all 4 ends of the crossover as potential problems, but I think it is the bottom two that are the actual problems.

In area 2 there will be a turntable and I know it creates problems and I am under the impression that at AR-1 will solve that, but I have not studied that yet.  One problem at a time is all I can handle!  To the left (West of) of the turntable the double track reduces to single track and then North of that it has a turnout to the left and right.  The right leg of that takes off and heads back East coming under some track and crossing some track just to the right of the number 3.

In that number 3 area that right leg from area 2 drops down and there is a turnout to run a track over to the Eastern most track of the double track just north of where the double track begins.  That turnout has a pencil circle over it because that is the other place where there is a polarity problem.

The rest of the layout is not shown in its entirety, but has no impact on the areas I have scanned.  But, basically it swings on around to the West and heads south and ends up coming back into the picture in the bottom right third of the sketch.  It has no loops of any kind.

So, the bottom line in my view is a problem at 1, 2, and 3.  2 is down the road a little ( and I may not even include the turntable), so I will save it for the future.  So my questions have to do with how to wire, how many, and where to place AR-1s to fix 1 and 3.

This is what happens when you let newbies play with trains!  Thanks again for the help.  Wish I had a better diagram but I think you can follow it.

Dan

[melarson]

I appreciate your scanning that in and posting it.  I will digest it a while and post a response tomorrow or Saturday.  Just a couple of questions.  Given the dimensions you gave can you tell me the length of the loop from the top of the double crossover and back (in feet and maybe also in how many trains it will hold of the lenght you envision running)?  Same for the track that goes from the switch in the NW corner back to area 3.  Thanks.

[dfischer71]

Michael,

I really appreciate your time and advice on this...  The loop from the top of the crossover all the way over the top of the layout and back to the crossover is about 32'.  Can't imagine having more than 2 or 3 trains in that area at one time.  Guess I could pack in more if I used short trains, but under normal conditions I would expect 2 but at times could see 3 there.

On the other one, from the turnout across the top and down to the turnout vic area 3 I would think there would only be one train at a time.  The distance there is 8'.

Again, thanks.

Dan

[melarson]

Dan,

Having studied you drawing, it appears to me you'll need three reversers (four if you decide to install the turntable).  Take a look at the attached drawing for reference.

Red and black represent your main feed rails.  The reverse sections are in green (both rails, to indicate that their polarity is dynamically reversible).  You will need to create a gap everywhere that green rails meet red and black rails, then feed the green sections of track through their respective AR-1.

Hope that helps.  Let us know if you have other questions.

--Michael

[Judge_KB]

Has anyone used a Frog Juicer rather than the Ring Engineering AR-1?  I don't mean to ruffle any feathers here with the question but I know many of us will look at cost.  I am just investigating different options right now and currently I do not have a layout.  I would need to look at a comparison of options provided by the different units or any other competitions equipment.  I will most likely stay with Ring as the equipment is compatible, but then again we are supposed to be able to run Ring equipped locomotives on DCC powered systems.

Kevin B.

[melarson]

Kevin,

I have not thought of using a Frog Juicer as an auto-reverse control.  I read up on Tam Valley Depot's website and they do make a dual juicer that can be configured as a reverser.  It does not specifically state it would work for pure DC (it does of course say it works for DCC), so were I you I would consider contacting them to ask that question.

But the dual juicer is $32, and you can get the RailPro AR-1 for $32 at either Precision Design Co (and free shipping) or Yankee Dabbler.  Not seeing any savings, I would stick with the RailPro product.  It costs no more and is 100% compatible and supported.

My two cents.

Michael