RailPro And Australia

[TwinStar]

Tim et al:

I have a fellow on FB who is Down Under and believes that he can't order/use/receive RailPro products. I'm completely ignorant on this and wanted to get some facts.

Thanks.

[CPRail]

I wonder if it's a similar situation to what we have in Canada.

Due to the fact that they are radio receivers/transmitters and aren't certified for use in Canada, Bill, our RPUG site host, can't ship them to other Canadians.

I can order them from Bill (who is an hour and a half drive from me), have him ship them to the US and then drive down to the US (bit of a pain right now with COVID) or import them myself from a dealer in the US via mail, but Bill can't ship them to me directly.

[G8B4Life]

Well he can get them, just not locally; as in Australia as a country.

Just like everyone all over the world not in the US he'll have to mail order from a US supplier that isn't Ring himself, many RailPro suppliers do ship RP internationally but Ring does advise them "that they shouldn't" though thankfully many will anyway.

My first RP purchase got cancelled that way, the supplier let it slip to Ring that it was going overseas and the supplier cancelled on me because of Rings advice, so I went elsewhere (which wasn't Bill as he wasn't a supplier then) and got them no problem.

The issue is that RailPro as a product is not a licensed device in the radio spectrum here (same as every country outside of the US) so it can not legally be sold here by a distributor/retailer but in a general sense it can be imported privately, with the caveat of the radio spectrum licensing authority (ACMA for the aussie gentleman) that they could confiscate it if it was found to be causing bad interference, which I can honestly say that I'd never expect to happen in a million years as RP is designed to be compliant here (Rings words), he just won't go through with getting RP approved. It's maddening!

Now, that being said I do remember that a fellow on this list from Australia had RP gear for sale secondhand but that was a long time ago now so I don't know if it's still available. Otherwise I'd suggest he could talk to our favorite forum supplier.

- Tim

[TwinStar]

Thanks Tim! I forwarded the info you posted.

[Graham54]

complete RailPro equipment still available sunshine coast qld Australia arnbos2@optusnet.com.au

[Filip]

Hi, This is a point I never had any idea of and it's like a cold shower to read this post.
I live in France and did research on the availability of RP here in the EU. Zero results. Now I understand why!
Still, I live in a remote place in the middle of nowhere and I wonder what the consequence can be using the RP.
What is the radio interference after all ?
Will it interfere with the radio or TV broadcast signal for my neighbor who lives 2 miles away ? Will it take the airplanes down who fly by ?
So, after all can I - an EU citoyen - buy the RP, say in the US, and have it shipped to my address in France - even if it's 'not legal' ?
Thanks, Filip

[G8B4Life]

Hi Filip,

I don't think anyone here will be very familiar with the regulations in France (and I suspect without being able to read/write French it'll be hard for us to locate and study them) but I would imagine the France regulations would be similar to elsewhere in the world. RailPro operates in the 2.4 Ghz spectrum which is the same as WiFi, and, I think that 2.4 Ghz might be the spectrum that things like RC aircraft use in France too so that would be helpful if that's the case.

RailPro doesn't have the power to transmit a signal 2 miles, either horizontally (your neighbour) or vertically (the planes overhead) so you'd be safe from that. Without being able to find and read the France regulations it's hard to say for you. I think you'd be ok buying from a US seller and having it shipped over but it's impossible to say for sure.

- Tim

[KPack]

Hi Filip,

I don't think anyone here will be very familiar with the regulations in France (and I suspect without being able to read/write French it'll be hard for us to locate and study them) but I would imagine the France regulations would be similar to elsewhere in the world. RailPro operates in the 2.4 Ghz spectrum which is the same as WiFi, and, I think that 2.4 Ghz might be the spectrum that things like RC aircraft use in France too so that would be helpful if that's the case.

RailPro doesn't have the power to transmit a signal 2 miles, either horizontally (your neighbour) or vertically (the planes overhead) so you'd be safe from that. Without being able to find and read the France regulations it's hard to say for you. I think you'd be ok buying from a US seller and having it shipped over but it's impossible to say for sure.

- Tim

That's what people in other countries have done.  Australia and Canada come to mind.  Of course Ring Engineering will say "no" if you ask them about shipping to a foreign country, which I can understand.  Ring does not want to be held liable for potential issues with another country's laws.  But I believe (at least in some countries) if a product is bought for personal use then it usually isn't an issue.

-Kevin

[Alan]

I don't believe lack of availability outside the US is a technical issue. After all, wi-fi and cordless phones on the same band are used worldwide. I think it is simply lack of certification. I doubt it is cheap and easy to go through the certification process.

I also believe it is legal to own, just not legal to sell. I'm not a lawyer or even play one on TV so do with this information what you will.

[Filip]

Merci beaucoup - Thank you very much for your kind replies !
It's a relief to read your comments and I understand the point. Wifi is indeed the same band here in the EU.
Indeed it seems a matter of certification.
Thanks to you all !
Greetings, Filip

[G8B4Life]

...I think it is simply lack of certification. I doubt it is cheap and easy to go through the certification process.

Certification is certainly the issue, every country just wants to make sure a radio transmitting device causes no harm to other parts of the radio spectrum and to other devices that use the same spectrum (!) and want to do it their own way (recognising another countries certification isn't usually a thing). The cost of certification is a huge stumbling block. Here, while the regulatory license for a 2.4 Ghz device is free the cost a of recognised testing agency to test for that license is a another matter.

The thing I find the funniest is that a 2.4 Ghz radio device has to be certified, but you can go an buy an off the shelf microwave oven that'll kill your WiFi every time you use it (for those that don't know microwave ovens also work at 2.4 Ghz)

I also believe it is legal to own...

I wouldn't say legal to own but more along the lines of "If no ones making complaints of interference we won't know anything about you having a non licensed device". Would I expect RailPro to ever fall afoul of interference complaints? no, it just doesn't have the power.

- Tim

[Marco]

My experience, I live in Germany.
I have had Railpro items sent directly from the USA twice. From two different dealers.
I always had to pick it up personally at customs in the next big city and explain what it was. Of course I didn't say anything about radio or WiFi   
They are "model railroad spare parts". Then tax and duty paid. Problem-free, even if I was very nervous.
I think it can be similar in France.
I could not find any malfunctions or interferences, everything is running perfectly.
I would take the risk again too. it's a great product. it is so much fun   
However, if customs knew exactly what it is, it would have to be destroyed upon import. burned money. 

Marco

[Filip]

To Marco and All,
Thanks for your reply - much appreciated !
My experience living in France for 20+ years is: It's a wonderful country but so sad there are French living here...
What I mean to say is: why would you keep or make it simple if you can make it difficult !
That's simply the 'French mentality'. But lets keep in line with this topic....
I'm convinced that RP is the way to go and I just need to examine the risk of 'burning money' when customs open the packet and discover the 'time bomb' inside!
Another issue is: RP comes at 110V  so how did you solve this ? Use another power supply ? What is the recommandation in this case ?
For the moment I use NCE Power Cab DCC. Bill suggested that I keep this to get started but will need a charge adapter 220V to 110V for the HC. ()
Any advise is most welcome !
Thanks & greetings,
Filip

[G8B4Life]

Another issue is: RP comes at 110V

Not quite correct. Unless things have changed since I got my HC-2b the PA-3 charger for the HC-2b is 110 to 240v input but it has pins for the US mains socket. There are a couple of ways around this:

Simply get one of those "travel adapters" (like you'd buy at an airport when you take your electric shaver overseas); find a USB charger that has the same rating as the PA-3 but with the mains plug that you have in France; or, do as I do and charge it via the USB ports of your computer or USB hub: https://rpug.pdc.ca/index.php/topic,616.0.html. Note this isn't the best way but it works.

The power supply for the PWR-56 is a 110 - 240v standard laptop type power supply so only needs a France plug to IEC lead to use it.

- Tim

[Marco]

Oh yes Filip. This overengineering is exactly the same in Germany   

I have the old HC-2 without b, white label. I think i bought it in 2016. For this I bought a new charger 220v (same specs 6V 1A) because the one supplied was really only for 110v. the new plug didn't fit exactly in the HC-2, so i have
cut it off from the original and assemble it on the new 220v. works well.
With the HC-2b, the travel adapter or USB loading is the way to go, I think.
The PWR-56 works with the included power supply (110-220v), but with an new EU cabel.

And definitely buy the CI-1 too. This makes a lot of things easier, transferring files to the LM-3S   
I never had a problem with the software. Here in the forum you can sometimes read strange connection problems. But everything works fine for me.   

Have converted 7 engines so far. ES44AC, SD60, MP15AC ... some with and some without the original board.